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    • How APR is going about Audi 8V RS3 & MKIII TT-RS Bosch MED17.1.62 2.5 TFSI ECU tuning and hardware development

      There is a lot of tuning talk about the new Audi TT-RS and Audi RS3 models with the updated 2.5 TFSI dual fuel injected I5 turbo motor. Recently, the MKIII Audi TT-RS broke into the 10's in the 1/4 mile tune only. This begged the question, where is the biggest name in Audi tuning and what are they doing on the platform?


      Well, APR is going about their development in their usual in-depth fashion. They have access to the Bosch MED17.1.62 ECU and software. They just are not releasing their dyno numbers just yet:


      It sure looks like they are getting some big gains there though despite the redacted peak figures.

      Audi changed a few things on the motor and there are many more sensors. APR is testing and collecting data before any releases. They are just being thorough.

      What we already know is that @Arin@APR confirmed the 2.5 TFSI turbo kit APR already developed that made over 600 horsepower to the wheels will fit without issue.

      As for upgraded internals, pistons and rods may need to be revised so no confirmation yet on whether APR's previous 2.5 TFSI forged hardware will work.

      They also have an upgraded intercooler in development as well:


      One can expect things to move pretty quickly. APR will release their software once testing is done with all their data. Then, you can expect the Stage 2 software for the intercooler and other bolt ons.

      The upgraded turbo kit should not take much time at all beyond software and some adaptations.

      The real question is, how far will APR push the motor? With fueling not being a big restriction the sky is the limit here.


      The 2.5 TFSI found in the brand new TTRS and facelifted RS3 sedan is a totally new 5-cylinder engine from Audi including an all new version of Bosch’s MED17.1.62 engine management system. The engine differs from other 5 cylinders in the past, using a brand new turbo, with a new control strategy, new dual injection system and new engine block material among other changes. We’re in uncharted territories tuning this new amazing platform!

      With any new project that vastly differs from others in the past, our engineers take a cautious and thorough approach to tuning the engine. This starts with data collection. Our APR ECU Explorer logging tool give us direct access to the entire ECU. That means we can read every sensor within the engine bay, and every single calculation taking place within the ECU, at extremely high data rates. This data resolution is second to none, leaving our tuners with the ability to see everything as it happens, with the ability to trace back to why it happened within the ECU. This allows our engineers to understand the ECU algorithms and strategies better than the competition. This is contrary to others relying on OBDII diagnostic channels, which gives poor and limited data used for general diagnostics, not tuning.

      However, even with this powerful tool, it’s not enough. When Audi tuned this engine, they did so with many more sensors installed, which they later removed and modeled into the ECU. By doing so, they saved money and can deliver a system that is modeled very accurately given the original operating parameters. With sensors removed, the engine management system predicts/models mass flow, pressures, temperatures and other measurements at various places within the engine system by basing those outputs on their relationships with other measured values. However, once you begin tuning the ECU, or changing hardware, these models are no longer very accurate! We need to add those sensors back during the tuning process to correct the incorrect/broken models, and provide a top tier ECU calibration.


      Our R&D team has installed a MoteC C125 Dash with various high resolution, and high data rate sensors all around the engine to collect critical data for our engineering team. This includes, but is not limited to Race-grade thermocouples and pressure sensors before and after the intercooler and at various places in the intake system to locate restrictions. We’ve also added exhaust manifold pressure sensors and exhaust gas thermocouples to the turbocharger to ensure our calibrations are well within critical engine limitations (shaft speed, EMAP, EGT, surge region operation, lambda sensor pressure and temperature compensation). With MoteC’s i2Pro software, we’re able to analyze and deliver critical data to our calibration and hardware teams create better calibrations and create new hardware products.


      With the guess work eliminated, we’re able to deliver a better product.

      Hardware

      This article was originally published in forum thread: APR RS3 / TTRS Development Update started by Arin@APR View original post
      Comments 17 Comments
      1. KEMA's Avatar
        KEMA -
        This package is amazing and can’t wait to see how far APR and IROZ will push the envelope.. Is there a better performance / tuning package in the premium compact segment? I need one!
      1. gaspam's Avatar
        gaspam -
        that intercooler is so pretty and seamless!

        cant wait to see results...

        funny i saw some C/D test of this car and it competes against the M2 but the RS3 is so far ahead that its actually matching and beating the M3, which competes in a higher up segment, in most of the test! This car is the car all the Audi fanboys like me have been waiting for since the old B5 S4 Click here to enlarge
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by gaspam Click here to enlarge
        funny i saw some C/D test of this car and it competes against the M2
        I need to take a look at that test.
      1. gaspam's Avatar
        gaspam -
        i saw it on another audi site :

        https://www.caranddriver.com/reviews...s3-test-review

        C/D TEST RESULTS:
        Zero to 60 mph: 3.5 sec
        Zero to 100 mph: 8.7 sec
        Zero to 130 mph: 15.4 sec
        Zero to 150 mph: 22.8 sec
        Rolling start, 5-60 mph: 4.3 sec
        Top gear, 30-50 mph: 2.8 sec
        Top gear, 50-70 mph: 3.2 sec
        Standing ¼-mile: 11.9 sec @ 117 mph
        Top speed (governor limited, mfr's claim): 174 mph
        Braking, 70-0 mph: 157 ft
        Roadholding, 300-ft-dia skidpad: 0.98 g

        Also, FWIW .98g on the skid pad is matching the BMW M3 Competition w/ DCT's latest CD Instrumented test. Actually, the RS3 bests it almost everywhere in instrumented performance except braking from 70mph!
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by gaspam Click here to enlarge
        Also, FWIW .98g on the skid pad is matching the BMW M3 Competition w/ DCT's latest CD Instrumented test. Actually, the RS3 bests it almost everywhere in instrumented performance except braking from 70mph!
        Just saw this. I'll write it up in a bit.
      1. Arin@APR's Avatar
        Arin@APR -
        Development continues! Great results so far. Stage 1, Stock hardware. 10.55@127.62 MPH.



        More details to follow.
      1. quattr0's Avatar
        quattr0 -
        Dang....mooovvvving!!!
      1. gaspam's Avatar
        gaspam -
        10.5 with tune only Damn!!!

        Im predicting 9s on stock turbos, full bolt ons , race fuel and a little minor weight reduction on RS3 Click here to enlarge
      1. richpike's Avatar
        richpike -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by gaspam Click here to enlarge
        10.5 with tune only Damn!!!

        Im predicting 9s on stock turbos, full bolt ons , race fuel and a little minor weight reduction on RS3 Click here to enlarge
        Is that really tune only (not sure what “stage 1” consists of)? If so, that is insane. Performance bargain of the century.

        -Rich
      1. Arin@APR's Avatar
        Arin@APR -
        Per the post, Tune only. (No performance hardware, like intake, exhaust, etc).
      1. Sticky's Avatar
        Sticky -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Arin@APR Click here to enlarge
        Per the post, Tune only. (No performance hardware, like intake, exhaust, etc).
        Send me that slip... pretty please.
      1. richpike's Avatar
        richpike -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by Arin@APR Click here to enlarge
        Per the post, Tune only. (No performance hardware, like intake, exhaust, etc).
        Anything SW loaded on the transmission? What octane fuel? Regardless, I can't think of another new car under $100K, let alone $55K that is this quick with just SW. Like I said, this is amazing.

        -Rich
      1. Arin@APR's Avatar
        Arin@APR -
        Click here to enlarge

        For the past several months, our engineers have meticulously tested and tuned the new 2.5 TFSI found in the Audi RS3 Sedan and TTRS. This has included hundreds of dyno pulls, over 40 passes at the drag strip and more than 50 laps around Road Atlanta. You can read more about our testing and instrumentation here: APR RS3 Sedan Testing and Tuning Update!
        Drag Strip:



        We visited our local drag strip, Montgomery Motorsport Park, to test the factory software vs our development software for the 2.5 TFSI found in our RS3 Sedan. In terms of engine / performance hardware, we tested our software only, leaving items such as the intake, exhaust, intercooler, fueling and more completely stock. The vehicle was equipped with Toyo R888 tires for added grip. Please Note: Date/Time stamps are 55 minutes ahead of the actual time.

        First, we ran the stock tune on 93 octane, full weight (DA: ~600 FT):

        11.85@113.30
        11.86@113.26
        11.97@112.42

        Next, we flashed the ECU to our development Stage 1 tune on 93 octane, full weight (DA ~800 FT):

        11.13@119.68
        11.15@119.09
        11.15@118.73

        Satisfied with these results we added ethanol from the pump and switched to our development Stage 1 ethanol tune and ran full weight for a single pass (DA: ~125 FT):

        10.76@125.61

        Lastly we put the RS3 on a 5 minute track diet, pulling the seats, saving around 150 lbs (DA: ~100 FT):

        10.55@127.62
        10.58@126.63
        10.62@127.58

        Time Slips:

        Click here to enlarge

        Road Course Testing:



        Following our successful outing at the drag strip, we headed to Road Atlanta for some brutal track testing. Testing on a road course puts the vehicle through some of the most demanding conditions. The engine is run at full tilt lap after lap, putting it through stress otherwise not seen on the road. In doing so, our calibration team is able to learn valuable information about how the engine handles the increased power in demanding situations our customers may experience. We tested each mode, Drive, Sport, and Manual, and were happy with the performance. Our RS3 was outfitted with our development APR 93 and Ethanol ECU Upgrades (as well as stock), APR 19x8.5 forged wheels with a previously used set of Pirelli Trofeo R tires, and APR Development Lowering Springs at full vehicle weight.

        Race Report from our Driver, Ian Baas:

        Good Morning,

        Thanks for a successful weekend everyone! The Car and Calibration was perfect and I’ve never been more excited about an APR release in my life. Most production street cars I’ve tested almost always show their weak points within 5-10 laps of any high performance track event. The RS3 Sedan excelled during the entire test and I am sure this product will perform flawlessly in street conditions as it sits currently!

        I really cannot stress enough how much this car exceeded my expectations!

        Best Time:
        RS3 Stage 1 (93 Octane Map)
        1:45.60 (RA Wet/Dry Conditions)

        S3 Stage 3+ (93 Octane Map)
        1:39.10 (RA Dry Conditions, earlier in the year)

        For Comparison sake these are Rain Times during this year’s Petit Le Mans Practice… Not bad!

        APR Engine/Calibration:
        A+

        Car performed very well during each Octane tested (Stage 1 E85, Stage 1 93, Stock). Power was strong and on demand throughout each outing. (+/- 10 laps per outing. 55 laps in total.)
        Engine Cooling was nominal, I saw little to no fluctuation, holding 240F throughout every run.

        Stock Transmission:
        B+

        By far the best VAG DSG I’ve driven. Transmission performed better than expected in Sport Mode and Manual Mode. Sometimes I could feel small delays in power delivery during apex out throttle application while in Sport Mode. For once I preferred Manual Mode for track driving, the DSG did just about everything you told it to do without electronic intervention. The only intrusive issue I experienced was while exiting turn 8 in 2nd gear, the transmission bounced off the rev-limiter for period of time and would not up-shift until I lifted off the throttle. This was during the last session of the day when I was giving Tyler a ride around the track and the fuel level was almost empty.

        Suspension with APR Development Springs:
        B+

        Without having any comparison to stock spring package it’s hard to say if the car was improved by the addition of APR springs but I can certainly say that the car did not have any glaring unwanted characteristics. We had changing track conditions all day long and the car handled them very well. The car was very neutral from apex out and inspired confidence throughout the track. Even though power output had been increased significantly, corner exit was especially good delivering just the right amount of power for a neutral exit. Corner entry/ Body roll could be better the rear did have the tendency to roll over and cause a slight over steer. I would be very interested in testing stiffer Anti-Roll Bars both independently and Front and Rear Together.

        Stock Brakes:
        B+

        I rarely pressured the brake zones due to poor weather conditions. The only negative experience was a soft/long brake pedal after momentary short stops in pit lane (under 2 mins). The pedal would come back after about a half lap but this is something I would like to address.

        - - - - - - - -

        Thank you for following our updates. We'll provide more testing data, such as final power figures, at our upcoming official release!

        Go APR!
      1. richpike's Avatar
        richpike -
        Click here to enlarge

        You might be the best advertisement for the RS3 that Audi could hope for. The RS3 is definitely on my shortlist for future cars! Super impressive.

        -Rich
      1. quattr0's Avatar
        quattr0 -
        And you guys just had to pass the GT3 didn't you? Click here to enlarge

        Very impressive! Congrats!
      1. harry's Avatar
        harry -
        How much for this tune only set up?

        Does it uninstall properly for hassle free service at the dealer?

        How anal is Audi compared to the other makes when it comes to modding?
      1. F16HTON's Avatar
        F16HTON -
        Click here to enlarge Originally Posted by harry Click here to enlarge
        How much for this tune only set up?

        Does it uninstall properly for hassle free service at the dealer?

        How anal is Audi compared to the other makes when it comes to modding?
        Has not ben released yet, therefore the pricing has not been determined. Programming for the previous model inline five was $899.00.

        Typically with APR programming, it can be uninstalled at one of their dealers, however this is no guarantee that it will not be detected. If you choose to have changes made to your ECU...they may have a way of detecting it.

        Audi is just like every other brand in the universe. They do not want to pay warranty on a claim that is related to modifying your powertrain.